Absolute classic - there you go folks, JGFCs blanket statement based on a home video! Be very careful about listening to anything this joker says - clueless! Doesn't see the 1st team players, or reserves, or youth, but thinks he knows better than the club, the WSU, the commercial guys, the manager, the owner blah, blah, blah...............
And what as to my previous, admittedly less vitriolic than JgFc's, comments about the way last years U18's were regarded and the lost potential?
I can assure you that I saw more of their games at U16 and 1st year U18 levels than anyone at PVR - Club, WUY or fan and I discussed them on several occasions with both Ken and Ade.
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YOUTH are the future
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"The worst thing you can do is make a committment and not meet it and I understand that." Barrie Hobbins 14 August 2010
I agree. Having seen them play your views are warranted and I know you were a great supporter of last year's U 18s - but
As in senior football, where players play is based on many factors. Your views of who had potential may well have been different from many others - including the manager, Ade etc etc. Fact is though, 2 were signed for the first team (I believe) and then were under a different umbrella - do you know where they are now?
As for the others, trials were held for this year's squad and all were invited. I have my opinions on whether they decided not to trial, whether they were good enough, and do know where a few of them went. You do, don't you, when you follow a certain age group? I also have an idea how those squads are doing now. Welling U18s are doing just fine. And before you correct me, I also know we are discussing 2 leagues now (does JGFC).
JGFC has no idea and has just jumped on the negative bandwagon.
I know you are a supporter of young players and continue to follow some players at Tonbridge Angels. However, just as in senior football your views on potential may, and probably does, differ from many others.
I don't believe the manager was 'shat over' as JGFC so elegantly puts it. But I do think a lot of this bad feeling is based on him not being offered a role in the reserves.
It has been said already on this site, that role needs to be given to someone qualified, proven, and with experience. He didn't have it.
You and I would know if anyone from Welling or Tonbridge U18s ever made it into Blue Square South level, without having to read about it elsewhere. JGFC would not.
I could go on - suffice to say it is refreshing to read an intelligent post from someone who has seen youth football, even if your views on potential are vastly different from mine - who is right remains to be seen.
But just because JGFC watched a video does not make the whole youth set up a shambles. You may not agree the older sides should fall into the youth remit. That does not equal a shambles.
I know what his answer will be ................................
I've no wish to tread old paths but my views on both WUY and last years U18's are well known and can be found in past postings for those who may not know them and are interested enough to know what they are. The only 2 things I will say are that firstly, I do not agree with your statement about Ken who still has more than a passing interest in all matters Welling United and secondly, its not just me who believes there were players in last years U18's who had potential since both Ade (whose ability to develop young players has been recognised with his Stoke appointment) and Gary Abbott told me in post match discussions that there were players with potential.
What is interesting is that the attention focuses on Rishi and Gabs, presumably because they made Conference South appearances, and neither as far as I know are playing for very different reasons. My reading of their situation was that with no budget available they were signed up as a emergency cover. In my opinion they were by no stretch of the imagination the finished article and ideally needed to go through a reserve structure and prove themselves before appearing in the Conference South, however, as I said I believe it was a case of 'needs must'.
Potential and achievement as you know do not necessarily go 'hand in glove' for all manner of reasons and many of those who stand out between the ages of 16/18 fall by the wayside and indeed were this not to be the case what chance would any lad from outside of the academy system stand of playing at a decent level. Others who are unknown to those who don't watch youth football have the necessary determination and commitment, and are prepared to make the necessary sacrifices, to maximise their potential and achieve their goal of playing football at a decent level and get paid for doing so. I believe there were several of the latter in last years U18's but as you say only time will tell if any actually make it.
Please don't run away with the idea that I have merely substituted Tonbridge Angels Youth for Welling United Youth. On Sundays this season so far I have been seen at VCD, Dulwich Hamlet, Bromley, Thamesmead, Erith Town, and Welling United youth matches as well as a couple of weekday Kent County U18 friendlies. Why? Because if you want to see attractive football you stand more chance of seeing it at senior youth level where players are being developed/learning their trade than in Blue Square Conference South games.
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YOUTH are the future
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"The worst thing you can do is make a committment and not meet it and I understand that." Barrie Hobbins 14 August 2010
Oh dear ive seen the young lad Bale at spurs on the box and think he will be another waddle and that makes my views any less does it?
Get a grip please. So in that reserve game that the young team (youths included?) Got destroyed by a reserve team of Thamesmead... How many of the current youth team were playing?
Has neil been to training? Offered advice? Like Adie Did? Ken wasnt shat on? The man is too honourable to reply on the forums but i heard enough on how he was treated to believe he was by the fisher/dulwich anyone who will pay them mob. Who by the way have a cheived jack at Welling!.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
IF you knew anything (which you clearly don't) and IF you were capable of debate without resorting to abusing young players, your views may have some credibility. Read Bruno's post above and try and learn something.
For your information, there is plenty of communication between Neil, Grant and the U18s Manager and yes, some are training with the 1st team. You would, of course, know this if you bothered to attend anything.
You brighten up my day JGFC - oh, and one last thing, the dog thing is getting pretty boring.
WUBM/Parent...................... I am sure to be christened something else - watch this space.
I would be interested to know the % of 1st team players who came through an academy system. Welling United Youth's squads do include a certain amount of older players who have come from this background but, lets be honest, the majority of 16-18 years olds still within an acedemy system are more likely to be playing Blue Square South in the future than those currently within the youth section now, or those recently moved on.
If the youth section do manage to nurture 1 or 2, with limited resources, at this level, it would be a massive feat. And these potential few will be approached constantly by other clubs promising the world.
Stafford once asked what the Youth Section aims were and if these were clarified then things may calm down.
Well, in my view, the Youth Section intends to promote football in the local community and provide exit routes for all - whether that be kent League, qualified coaches, future referees or managers and potentially a few 1st team players and 1st team supporters. This done outside of an academy envoironment, with little funding.
After one season, a lot has been achieved but I am sure there is more work to be done.
Any constructive ideas may assist and perhaps provide a bit of unity.
As far as the current Welling squad goes this information isn't readily available from the Club but my research indicates that the origins are as follows:
From Academies 5 + 3 loanees From youth structure 1 Old pros (who were probably youth players in pre academy days) 5 don't know 6
Of those who have departed so far this season From Academies 3 Old Pros 1 Non league 2
Since more and more academies/college based schemes are being established and based on the above, Blue Square South level and above is a pretty tough target for a non academy/college based player to achieve. The problem with this in my opinion is that the academically gifted schoolboy who also has footballing potential but focuses on later career related studies and therefore plays youth football is faced with an immense mountain to climb.
As far as Welling and its involvement with youth football is concerned I find the whole matter very confused.
Maybe I'm being too simplistic but I see the situation as being:
1. The very welcome return to an official youth development programme with the recently established college based side which is a joint venture with Lewisham College.
2. The Community scheme which reaches out into the community promoting football and Welling United through the provision of introduction to football for U7's, football coaching sessions for 7-10 year olds, and coaching sessions for organised and school teams.
3. Welling United Youth a club which carries the Welling United name but is basically a junior/youth football club whose aims are as stated by WUBM. I know that this club was set up in conjunction with Welling United and for teams to play in the KYL they need to be part of a senior club but I have seen nothing beyond a page in the programme to suggest that Welling United are any more than 'sleeping partners of convenience'. If this were genuinely a part of Welling United's youth development policy it would in my opinion at the very least need to come under the remit of a Youth Development Officer, have a clear and identifiable position in the Club structure and be able to demonstrate a clear potential progression path through the Club structure for players.
May I be burnt at the stake as a heretic but is there any progress on the promotion of womens/girls football?
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YOUTH are the future
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"The worst thing you can do is make a committment and not meet it and I understand that." Barrie Hobbins 14 August 2010
IF you knew anything (which you clearly don't) and IF you were capable of debate without resorting to abusing young players, your views may have some credibility. Read Bruno's post above and try and learn something.
For your information, there is plenty of communication between Neil, Grant and the U18s Manager and yes, some are training with the 1st team. You would, of course, know this if you bothered to attend anything.
You brighten up my day JGFC - oh, and one last thing, the dog thing is getting pretty boring.
WUBM/Parent...................... I am sure to be christened something else - watch this space.
HEHE
Talk about wishy wash.. Wasnt it YOU who was abusive under an anon posting spree on the main forum??
Some of them go to training?? Whos this then Neil, Grant?? Or a friend of the fisher crew??
Dont get abusive with me or try tothink you know who i am or what i know. Because you are only guessing.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
Welling want to be seen as having a youth / reserves to "look" professional, so they do it cheap or free (the way the do everything) hense its no where near up to standard and get any old mugs to do the work for them.
In a nutshell, JgFc who knows Nothing, knows more than peiple think... One day i will release a lot of stuff and your jaws will hit the floor....
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
Welling want to be seen as having a youth / reserves to "look" professional, so they do it cheap or free (the way the do everything) hense its no where near up to standard and get any old mugs to do the work for them.
In a nutshell, JgFc who knows Nothing, knows more than peiple think... One day i will release a lot of stuff and your jaws will hit the floor....
Not having the 'inside' knowledge of how things work at Welling, or how the basis of the youth team set up works, I would like to put my two penn'th worth in: It appears that the 'Management' does diddly squat towards anything other than self gratification. These people have been in charge for years and we still haven't progressed any further than the team we beat on Saturday. I have only been following the team for the last couple of years and in my humble opinion, we haven't gone into the latest century. The fans were robbed last season because of the floodlight situation( another topic I know ) But as for that numpty JgFc suggesting that people concerned with the youth set up are only there to look professional is a joke. Ordinary and I use the term generically, people, give up their time etc to train, encourage and bring forward young players to a decent standard, is only to be encouraged. Out of 200 youngsters, how many do you think would make it through the ranks? 5 maybe 6? Even then, they might only play in a local side. Although Neil is relatively 'new', I hope and believe that he has the finger in the pulse and looks at up and coming players...........maybe I am wrong, who knows? ( If you read this Neil, get out there and prove us right ) As stated on many occasions, youth are our future.
I agree that WU should do more in the community to help / encourage young players to come through...........but what is the answer? Bruno and maybe other people have attended various matches regarding the Under 18's etc. and they can give an accurate account ..............far more than you JgFc. As for one day releasing things that will make peoples jaws drop.................you keep saying things, but nothing happens. You are an enigna, or should I say toss pot? I have nothing personal against you, but for once in your life, step on the plate and make yourself accountable.
