Nags head no longer has Sky Sports?! On a side note, I believe BT are getting the majority of the 12:45 Saturday games next season. So they might be a cheaper alternative: especially if the club has BT Broadband.
-- Edited by Trundle on Monday 20th of May 2013 04:42:41 PM
If the Nags pay £750 a month and are open all week, lets assume PVR is £400 a month.
That's £4800 a year.
23 league games, plus friendlies, say 26 games. Average £184 per game.
£3 a drink.
61 sales needed.
30.5 people having two drinks each.
Can we not expect an extra 60 drink sales over a 90 minutes if marketed correctly ?? and those averages account for Hyde, Gateshead etc ... Charlton pre-season and Luton etc will more than off-set a Hyde or a Gateshead.
-- Edited by Kevin on Monday 20th of May 2013 05:14:10 PM
He said 20% of the 500...meaning 100. It doesn't have to be Luton, that was just the best case scenario because that will probably be the game with the largest away following. I'm sure the introduction of Sky Sports could lead to far more than the hypothetical 61 extra drink sales needed to make it worthwhile.
I don't go into the Guy Earl after a game for the ambience, or for the food, I go in there because they have football on the telly. And it seems to be the same for another 30+ Welling fans every week. Just keeping those in PVR for an extra hour after a game would cover the cost, never mind the additional away support + those who already stay in the Wings bar afterwards.
-- Edited by Ashford Wing on Monday 20th of May 2013 08:12:10 PM
Theyve never even put the stand lights on on an evening game ffs and people want to let them earn money?
If its a big gate then do some outdoor lager tables ala Easteigh game, If its segregating to avoid trouble then no alcohol will be allowed to away fans anyway,
Id rather put a portacabin in the corner between new stand and park and sell lager out of that than let erith open their bar and make a penny.
If they did a thing for the ground then my views may change but as they stand, give them NOTHING is my view. And certainly dont make things "nice and cosy" for the oppo.
When we were in this league before we were not here to make PVR a nice place for the oppo. We need to wise up, much like Dartford did in the play off final and Garry Hill tried to do by putting us out in the wet.
By giving oppo the new stand weve already created a platform for them to sing and make noise and get behind their team before the off. They should have been in the road end and their players warming up in the park end... end of story. Cant wait for when its hammering down and their fans sing at ours about getting wet... then it might sink in.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
If Erith put fencing and gate at road end by main gate and a gate between their club house,and new stand, then maybe they can open their bar when segregation allows or on non segregated games?
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
We MUST get this. Cost should not be an issue. It will bring in over and above the cost in the short-term, and be massively profitable in the medium/long term.
With the huge increase in away supporters visiting PVR, and even indirect issues like the Nags no longer having Sky Sports, we would be missing a potentially large income stream if we don't get it.
Where does the football fan go for the 12.45pm Saturday kick-off and then the 5.30pm kick-off after the game ?? Not in the Welling bar that's for sure. That's 100s lost every week, God knows how much over the season. I would, poor decor or otherwise, happily sit in the Wings Bar and spend my money there before and after the game, over the dirty Guy Earl of Warwick.
Paul, if you are reading this, can you perhaps get a quote and let us know out of interest what it is ?? I'd be very interested to know.
I am sure a sensible solution can be found. Even if a few hundred a month, if marketed correctly it is merely cash-flow not cost.
Let's make it a Welling bar thread not Nags Yes, I think they are calling Sky's bluff over cost, but all the same, Welling need to look into this.
500 Luton fans x 20% drink before and after game @ £3 a drink = £600 in one afternoon. 100 people that will probably go in the Guy before the game otherwise.
A couple of years ago the then WSU looked at the cost and i believe it was at least £400 a month, looking round quickly on the web now, the cost can be anywhere from £500 to £2500 a month, depending on the venue's rateable value.
The Nags stopped their Sky Sports subscription as i believe it was costing £750+ a month, that would be an huge sum of money to try and re-coup. A better option would be to try and get BT Sport in which has a good selection of 5.30pm games.
The other thing to consider is the food/drinks. In the Nags there is a wider range of food available. Some people will therefore choose to eat there instead of a Tesco's own brand pie in the microwave!
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Welling United FC. Banging on the walls of Woking dressing rooms since 1963..
Yes, point taken. But all the same, if we couldn't re-coup the money Sky Sports cost we'd be doing something seriously wrong.
£750 a month is a lot of money to the Nags, but they will lose that this season. Take me, I live opposite the pub, shall I sit on my sofa and watch the 12.45pm for free, or go to the Nags and watch it with mates and spend £20 in the bargain. Doesn't take many people to do the same and that £750 looks cheap all of a sudden.
Let's make it a Welling bar thread not Nags Yes, I think they are calling Sky's bluff over cost, but all the same, Welling need to look into this.
500 Luton fans x 20% drink before and after game @ £3 a drink = £600 in one afternoon. 100 people that will probably go in the Guy before the game otherwise.
This would be a huge expense and not guaranteed income.
What if the Luton game is midweek and, even if it isn't, there is no guarantee of a live game on the day we are scheduled to play them?
What about clubs like Hyde, Alfreton, Gateshead, Tamworth etc....who may bring between 25-50 away fans and then be leaving the ground at the end of the match?
As Dean has mentioned this was looked into and not considered viable at the time and I am not sure if the costs have increased since then.
Its obvious it would need fencing by the main gate , a gate there and also a gate between the erith bar and new stand. This costs money. Weigh up if the money is a good investment. I think it is as our fans get to stay in their seats and out of the wet, Their fans get no cover. It also doesnt give them a big advantage in creating a lot of noise.
If its raining hard who is going to sing more.. those under cover or those out in the wind and rain with no cover? If its raining which set of fans do you want to look after your own who come every week or those that come once a season and support the oppo?
Im not sure if anyone has tried to get costings or put an appeal out for the work to be done or if weve asked Erith to chip in, but the road end (Given we cant put them in the park end as no turnstiles) would seem the best all round in all ways. Weve also had 2-3 months between seasons to look into it before we go again in pre season.
If its winter.... and you need support, how many of the floaters or elderly or familys who support us will think stuff that im not going there as the oppo get the seats and it means getting soaked and standing up? We might segregate and they might bring 100, we could lose that amount of our own fans prefering to stay dry at home if the weather is awful.
Many positives in sticking the oppo in an open terrace and keeping our fans and floaters dry and happy.. positives on and off the pitch and probably in the bank balance.
Given that grants are available for upto 50% of the cost for fencing and safety improvements,,, it would be chicken oriental not to look into while we have the chance. its a win win if we sorted it. We can also apply for a grant for upto 50% off repairing the terracing and new tea bars and toilets.
FSIF eligibility criteria
Step 1
Step 2
Steps 3 & 4
Step 5
Step 6
Step 7
Maximum grant value
£400k
£250k
£150k
£100k
£100k
£20k
Maximum grant percentage
50%
50%
50%
50%
70%
70%
Project
New covered seating
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
New open seating
No
No
No
No
No
No
New open or covered safe terracing
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Upgrading open safe terracing
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Convert terrace to open seating
No
No
No
No
No
No
Convert terrace to covered seating
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
First aid rooms
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Secure boundary fencing and gates
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Pitch perimeter rails, barriers + infill
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Players and officials safe walkway
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Pitch perimeter hardstanding
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
P A systems (initial provision only)
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
CCTV (initial provision only)
Yes1
No
No
No
No
No
Computerised turnstiles
Yes1
No
No
No
No
No
Control rooms
Yes1
No
No
No
No
No
Mains service connections
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Crush barrier installations
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
New floodlights and upgrades2
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
No
Emergency lighting (initial provision only)
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Spectator toilets
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Press seating
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Turnstile and pay kiosks
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Changing rooms
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes3
Pitch drainage
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Pitch irrigation4
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes5
Yes5
Car and coach parking
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Access roads
No
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Stewards radios (initial provision)
Yes
Yes
No
No
No
No
Hospitality areas (incl. tea bars)6
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Artificial pitches
No
No
No
No
No
No
Viewing for disabled spectators
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
All facilities for disabled spectators
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Dug-outs/technical areas
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Pitch maintenance equipment7
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Ball stop netting8
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Yes
Goalposts
No
No
No
No
No
Yes9
Hopefully with WUSA, Sponsors, The Club, Our board of directors and Grants we could make some improvements.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
If the Nags pay £750 a month and are open all week, lets assume PVR is £400 a month.
That's £4800 a year.
23 league games, plus friendlies, say 26 games. Average £184 per game.
£3 a drink.
61 sales needed.
30.5 people having two drinks each.
Can we not expect an extra 60 drink sales over a 90 minutes if marketed correctly ?? and those averages account for Hyde, Gateshead etc ... Charlton pre-season and Luton etc will more than off-set a Hyde or a Gateshead.
-- Edited by Kevin on Monday 20th of May 2013 05:14:10 PM
Only £4000 because we would have the sense, I hope, to get rid of it for the 2 summer months in which there are no premier league games being shown. I can pretty much guarantee the Nag's are doing the same and will suddenly have it back for the start of the new season.
errr &00 Luton Fans will NOT be in our bar....also if Woking was anything to go by ALL pubs were told to close 3 hours before the match!!!...It would be segregated
errr &00 Luton Fans will NOT be in our bar....also if Woking was anything to go by ALL pubs were told to close 3 hours before the match!!!...It would be segregated
Point one - correct, as its a hole with no Sky Sports, that sells out of beer.
Point two - all the more reason to action as the pubs are shut, PVR could clean up, COULD being the word, if we have beer and Sky Sports.
Plus how would the bar fit 500 Luton fans on top of the loyal Welling supporters who spend their beer money in there, and not in the Nags or Guy, before and after the game every other Saturday?
Well I cannot agree more.....I have to hope that we are in negotiations with E & B &Q......Paul/peter...can you confirm or otherwise.....A great money making excercise
Dartford, Luton, Woking, Aldershot, Barnet, Grimsby, Cambridge, Wrexham, Chester, Lincoln, Halifax. Nearly half of our league games and all games which could well attract crowds over 1000. No doubt some of these games will be segregated but whether segregated or not it makes no sense for the E&B clubhouse and bar to be closed for these games when the Wings Bar may be struggling to cope. Surely something could be negotiated with E&B which would be beneficial to both clubs. It has been organised for the Charlton friendlies so it shows that it is possible.
Why should Erith make bombs by opening for big games?
Why should we let the oppo have the best area of ground then let them get beered up?
If we are segregated we get no bar and stuck out in open mostly.
Lets not see Erith make loads out of us, I cant think of ONE single thing theyve done for PVR since theyve been here, and dont say the stand as Welling got a grant and funded half of that.
Oh please Luton fans, do come and sit in the nice stand while our fans get wet and please come and get trolleyed in the erith bar and make them more money than they will make all season. We will even have a word with the ref and get him to give you a few decisions.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
Why should Erith make bombs by opening for big games?
Why should we let the oppo have the best area of ground then let them get beered up?
If we are segregated we get no bar and stuck out in open mostly.
Lets not see Erith make loads out of us, I cant think of ONE single thing theyve done for PVR since theyve been here, and dont say the stand as Welling got a grant and funded half of that.
Oh please Luton fans, do come and sit in the nice stand while our fans get wet and please come and get trolleyed in the erith bar and make them more money than they will make all season. We will even have a word with the ref and get him to give you a few decisions.
Sadly that's probably what we'll do.
Short of us making major improvements to our own bar, which we would all like but I can't see the club being willing to pay for, we need the E&B bar. I don't think we can afford go with the "cut off your nose to spite your face" approach. If E&B benefit (undeservedly) so that we can make more money, then so be it.
Absolutely agree that opposition fans should be housed in the road end. Sadly so far there is no indication that anyone is interested in trying to make this happen.
You have no idea of the logistics of taking over an already used bar for a day, What happens to their stock thats half used? Much cheaper , much easier to have an away bar from a hut/cabin or tables selling plastics, we get all the profit then too.
I still think if its segregated that the police will say that they cant use local pubs and they cant use any bars at the ground.
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
Why should Erith make bombs by opening for big games?
Why should we let the oppo have the best area of ground then let them get beered up?
If we are segregated we get no bar and stuck out in open mostly.
Lets not see Erith make loads out of us, I cant think of ONE single thing theyve done for PVR since theyve been here, and dont say the stand as Welling got a grant and funded half of that.
Oh please Luton fans, do come and sit in the nice stand while our fans get wet and please come and get trolleyed in the erith bar and make them more money than they will make all season. We will even have a word with the ref and get him to give you a few decisions.
we split the costs - give them a percentage of the money taken or we can just be children and not open and noone makes money.....great idea
Much easier for us to put a portacabin or hut doing lager in plastics. We get all the profit there too.
I still feel why should we give them a copper coin off our backs. Can anyone name me a single thing theyve done for the benefit of PVR since theyve been here apart from the joint funded stand?
Remember when the floodlights went and they never paid a penny, we had to squeeze in games elsewhere and late in the season and missed out on play offs.
If they want to benefit off our back they can start doing work on the ground etc and allowing lights on in the stand etc.
Easy, put two gates up to segregate the road end including their bar, re-concrete the terracing, put the electricity on and maybe just maybe they can make more than they make all season at one of our games from their bar. Didnt they get millions from B&Q ??
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Alexander O'Neal 1987 "I'm fed up cos all you wanna do is criticize "
I think as we share the ground we should work together on this, why cant we just hire the bar out from them on the matchdays we need it, that way they get a one off price and we take all the profit got to be cheaper than hiring a portacabin.
You have no idea of the logistics of taking over an already used bar for a day, What happens to their stock thats half used? Much cheaper , much easier to have an away bar from a hut/cabin or tables selling plastics, we get all the profit then too.
I still think if its segregated that the police will say that they cant use local pubs and they cant use any bars at the ground.
I am with JGFC on this one. We can not have Erith making money out of our success. We need to find alternatives so we get the moeny. Not sure that people will fancy a beer outside on a cold rainy night in November but the principle is right. I think it is right that the big games will be segreated with no alcohol to the away fans.
I think it is also right that we do not give away supporters the new stand. Maybe a section of it but not all of it.
Last home game there was a table outside the clubshop selling lager in plastic pint pots, surely we can set one up on the other side of ground for the away support.
Last home game there was a table outside the clubshop selling lager in plastic pint pots, surely we can set one up on the other side of ground for the away support.
Why was it only done for that one game. Someone earlier in the season preached "league rules" but you can drink at Bromley in view of the pitch. I see no reason the beer procedure for the last home game can't apply every game.
Last home game there was a table outside the clubshop selling lager in plastic pint pots, surely we can set one up on the other side of ground for the away support.
Why was it only done for that one game. Someone earlier in the season preached "league rules" but you can drink at Bromley in view of the pitch. I see no reason the beer procedure for the last home game can't apply every game.
Must have made money from it, I remember Bognor Regis letting you drink outside on the terrace.
Last home game there was a table outside the clubshop selling lager in plastic pint pots, surely we can set one up on the other side of ground for the away support.
Why was it only done for that one game. Someone earlier in the season preached "league rules" but you can drink at Bromley in view of the pitch. I see no reason the beer procedure for the last home game can't apply every game.
Going back to Kevin's original point, would it be possible for Paul or someone from the club/Wusa to get a quote so we know what the actual cost is for Sky. I do appreciate it may be too costly but around 4-5 times a season I bring a few mates to games and we always start and end in The Guy only to watch a live game and we would all prefer to watch it in the ground.
Last home game there was a table outside the clubshop selling lager in plastic pint pots, surely we can set one up on the other side of ground for the away support.
No surprise that that initiative was Dean Lee's work and not the owners'
I'm in total agreement with those who don't want to allow EB&Q to make a penny off the back of our success. They are little more than parasites. Their antics when the floodlight pylon fell down were remarkable, they didnt do a thing and claimed it was on 'the Welling side of the ground' so not their responsibility.
Its a groundsharing deal without the sharing of any responsibility.
Regardless of who makes money and who doesn't, we need to supply half decent facilities for away fans. A lot of the fans who will be visiting PVR for the first time will be shocked if they can't even get a beer at half time (how would we like it?). Unless it's on police advice we need to sort out a deal with Erith or at the least get a temporary bar in place, although open air drinking in November won't appeal. A lot of fans will be visiting us for the first time, do we want to discourage them returning or bad mouthing us to others?
Regardless of who makes money and who doesn't, we need to supply half decent facilities for away fans. A lot of the fans who will be visiting PVR for the first time will be shocked if they can't even get a beer at half time (how would we like it?). Unless it's on police advice we need to sort out a deal with Erith or at the least get a temporary bar in place, although open air drinking in November won't appeal. A lot of fans will be visiting us for the first time, do we want to discourage them returning or bad mouthing us to others?
Agree, I understand where people are coming from but when it's taken to the extremes it seems a bit petty. Grimsby came away from PVR this season with nothing but good things to say about us, and we'll probably see the benefit of that from the away following they'll bring with them. Whilst that won't help matters for us on the pitch, it will help the finances of the club - and we need to make a compromise there if we want to progress.
