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Theres talk of the 19 clubs from the National North and South who voted to continue the season bringing a legal protest against  the National league for stopping the season. Look at the National. Dover cant afford to pay their players or continue the season. How can the season be legit if one or more teams deliberately decide not to play. This is a massive case of the haves and haves not. 



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Dover were in trouble before the pandemic, in normal circumstances they would of been in administration and relegated but can use the pandemic as a excuse.

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Must only be talk. A legal challenge would take another couple of months at least. And what would a Court decide anyway? 



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Dodgy Dart wrote:

Must only be talk. A legal challenge would take another couple of months at least. And what would a Court decide anyway? 


 They can't afford to continue, but have money for a legal challange....... !



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So...Are we one of the 'haves'?

LOL!!

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Regardless of the rights or wrongs of the decision to stop the season, going legal is pointless, it could take months and loads of cash to conclude, by which time clubs should be into pre-season friendly matches, covid permitting.



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A legal challenge would only benefit one section of the community, the legal profession. The moral here must be dont waste much needed money on a lost cause.

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Playmaker

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The 19 were happy when resolutions came out ?
All voted
Lost vote hard to accept
Democracy rules to the 19 get over it prepare for next season when hopefully everything is back to normal ?

Well done to all WUFC volunteers

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According to Marc White, owner and manager of Dorking, they have taken legal advice (not legal action) and have spent the week in dialogue with the National League. He is convinced that football will resume for the clubs who want it but doesn't know what the format will be. He thinks that if it's a mixture of the two leagues, it may drop to 14 clubs involved but is looking at two or three clubs being promoted.



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So....as I am a bit confused here from what you are eluding to Mark could that mean that us choosing to say 'lets play on' may finish with us being relegated over those that chose otherwise .

If that is a possible scenario then it is one I certainly am not comfortable with

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I think it will mean promotion and relegation between the National league and the North/south league but no relegation from North/South league to the leagues below. I could be wrong.

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Ahhhhh...ok

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Riverstown wrote:

I think it will mean promotion and relegation between the National league and the North/south league but no relegation from North/South league to the leagues below. I could be wrong.


 That's my understanding too. According to some reports (which might be completely made up), The National League is concerned that if they don't relegate anyone, the EFL might say 'why should we?' It won't help with their campaign for three up, three down between the NL and EFL.



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Playmaker

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Whatever way you look at it, as far as we are concerned,it would be spending money for nothing.

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Exactly

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I think you can take it that those that think they have money will blow some of it on lawyers and those that know they don't and have acted accordingly will be putting some of the little they do have aside for lawyers.

End result, when the game needs every penny it has, money will readily funnel out of it with, I suspect, all there will be to show for it will be a more acrimonious mess..



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If this mini league happens, would the clubs start on zero points. If so, our recent results against Dartford and Ebbsfleet suggest we might do OK and could target playoffs if they have them.

Personally, I'd void the season but if we are to play on let's be positive about it.

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Keef wrote:

If this mini league happens, would the clubs start on zero points. If so, our recent results against Dartford and Ebbsfleet suggest we might do OK and could target playoffs if they have them.

Personally, I'd void the season but if we are to play on let's be positive about it.


 If the world cup can .....then why not put the entire season to Penalty shoot-out.... all from one ground, over two days

Or if teams are struggling, have a one day 5-a-side competition

 

WHy?

 

 

CoS it's all as amatuerish as the ideas being floated about :) :)



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It appears that some of the clubs and the league are discussing it with the FA on Monday. I note that Havant and Waterlooville have now said that they will not take part but that Braintree Town, who were not amongst the clubs on the original letter, played a friendly against a Gillingham XI on Tuesday night. 



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Any update on this. I see it was leaked to Guardian who mentioned a NDC. Also Mr White at Dorking has gone suspiciously quiet.



-- Edited by Cliffewoodswing on Sunday 7th of March 2021 10:08:11 AM

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Cliffewoodswing wrote:

Any update on this. I see it was leaked to Guardian who mentioned a NDC. Also Mr White at Dorking has gone suspiciously quiet.



-- Edited by Cliffewoodswing on Sunday 7th of March 2021 10:08:11 AM


 Latest I have read elsewhere the 19 are now 16 but nothing else seems to be forthcoming thanks to the NDC you mention.



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It is madness to me

What possible reason would there be for Welling United to travel way up north spending money we haven't got just to satisfy the one or two 'money' clubs that see it as an easy route into the national

I hope we are one of the 3

We voted for the whole league to continue not a hybrid model

Roll on August with hopefully a semblance of a side that can compete from game 1

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MarkX wrote:

It is madness to me

What possible reason would there be for Welling United to travel way up north spending money we haven't got just to satisfy the one or two 'money' clubs that see it as an easy route into the national

I hope we are one of the 3

We voted for the whole league to continue not a hybrid model

Roll on August with hopefully a semblance of a side that can compete from game 1


 Why do you think this will restart in August. Who with any logic is going to start a season with no certainty of the funding model in place or a certainty of a worthwhile outcome? And there is no certainty all the time new Government regulations of unknown nature 'may' be imposed in a matter of days/weeks with no parliamentary vote and with no compensatory regime agreed for that eventuality.



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Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back

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MarkX wrote:


We voted for the whole league to continue not a hybrid model


 Not strictly true.

Welling United were one of the 19 clubs that put their name on the letter to explore a way of reaching a conclusion. In his interview, the Dorking owner, who appears to be one of the leaders in this, stated that he expects the number to drop to 13 or 14 clubs so we shall see.

The meeting between all of the parties is tomorrow, so there is no real point in speculating on which clubs would participate until we know the outcome of that.



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Fair enough....just dont want us to plead poverty if we engage with this

Wait and see is correct

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MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022



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Wings1963 wrote:
MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022


 A presumption I too was making but has what particular relevance to the argument of certainty of outcome given that the base legislation under which every other restrictive measure that has been brought in since last March is in force until at least next March. Given the apparent enthusiasm with which it has been both used and embraced, why should the outcome of any season scheduled to start next August have any different outcome to the one just passed?



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Wings1963 wrote:
MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022


 A break in summer is needed to re-seed the pitch. What season are you suggesting should start in June and finish in January? This season or next season. If this mini-league happens it has to be finished by June, then all leagues at all levels can start again in August.

 



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Danson Mark wrote:
Wings1963 wrote:
MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022


 A break in summer is needed to re-seed the pitch. What season are you suggesting should start in June and finish in January? This season or next season. If this mini-league happens it has to be finished by June, then all leagues at all levels can start again in August.

 


 Basically acknowleging the lack of summer break, so if it's a mini league/tournament, then i understand it'll be done and dusted fairly quickly.

 

Be just as well having penalties.... get it done. World cup is decided that way!



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Wings1963 wrote:
Danson Mark wrote:
Wings1963 wrote:
MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022


 A break in summer is needed to re-seed the pitch. What season are you suggesting should start in June and finish in January? This season or next season. If this mini-league happens it has to be finished by June, then all leagues at all levels can start again in August.

 


 Basically acknowleging the lack of summer break, so if it's a mini league/tournament, then i understand it'll be done and dusted fairly quickly.

 

Be just as well having penalties.... get it done. World cup is decided that way!


 So if you are starting in August, when is your shutdown for the recently mooted flu lockdown next winter?



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Wings1963 wrote:
Danson Mark wrote:
Wings1963 wrote:
MarkX wrote:

Well....I say it on the presumption we are out of lockdown by June 21st hence fans back


 agreed, play through the summer, with a break in January 2022


 A break in summer is needed to re-seed the pitch. What season are you suggesting should start in June and finish in January? This season or next season. If this mini-league happens it has to be finished by June, then all leagues at all levels can start again in August.

 


 Basically acknowleging the lack of summer break, so if it's a mini league/tournament, then i understand it'll be done and dusted fairly quickly.

 

Be just as well having penalties.... get it done. World cup is decided that way!


I have no issue with the games being decided by a penalty shoot out.

D******* will be in the Ryman in no time..! 



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Dont think there will be any lockdown in winter....we may have mask wearing back but the intention is to be as normal as possible

 

Subject to a very nasty new variant....all of the other variants are covered by vaccine



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MarkX wrote:

Dont think there will be any lockdown in winter....we may have mask wearing back but the intention is to be as normal as possible

 

Subject to a very nasty new variant....all of the other variants are covered by vaccine


 Last March, did you think the initial lockdown would last more than three weeks? Has anyone actually said what 'normal as possible' quantifably is or are you just making an assumption based on what you'd like it to be? You won't be alone. Who defines what is possible?

Why do you think 'we may have mask wearing back'? That presumes it will have gone away in the first place. Based on the evidence of last year, I doubt it. Skegness raceway was allowed its limited capacity last year without masks. Northampton (about the same size and crowd), Hednesford and Ipswich (much larger compared to the limited crowd size), masks were mandatory. (Suffolk was only not in Tier 1 last year allegedly because it was a health minister's constuency and they wanted to avoid accusations of favouritism) Short circuit ovals all bigger than PVR for a not much larger crowd. Why? Because those were the health and safety regimes mandated by the local council who grant the licences. Which camp would you put Bexley council in? I have my thoughts on that.

Viruses mutate. Also, given that the source of the virus is as yet unverified and even the WHO seem to find the wet market theory hard to continue supporting, the last sentence is probably a bigger hostage to fortune than you intended. Who judges what is nasty and by what visible criteria?

I have been genuinely trying to understand your position for the last nine months but you give scant evidence as to how you've formed it. I've tried to give evidence for mine at each stage.

 



-- Edited by stafford on Tuesday 9th of March 2021 02:15:51 PM

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As a scientist I tend towards that way of thinking

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MarkX wrote:

As a scientist I tend towards that way of thinking


  Or did you confuse it with scientologst, because you don't become a scientist until you can explain the knowledge to someone else and they can understand it. Until that point, you are just a crank experimenting blowing up your shed.

No answer to main points though, I note, scientific or not.



-- Edited by stafford on Tuesday 9th of March 2021 06:52:06 PM

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Knowing my luck, when we do reopen, I will be stuck behind you at the bar.

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Staffy.....The scientific ...be it clinical ( my science) or mathematical modelling ..background to this pandemic is there for everyone to read, digest and understand. An unknown virus means that we have learn what it does or doesn't do as we go along.....New Scientist is a start if interested plus the published reports

We don't know a lot of things yet

1. How long do the vaccines last for and therefore will we need another one in Autumn
2. How much does the vaccine stop transmission
3. What level of herd immunity do we need for the virus to pretty much go....Measles is around 95% and Polio around 80% I think
4. Will a mutant where the spike protein is changed or damaged to such a level where the vaccines are ineffective arrive...luckily now we have the base vaccine altering it will be relatively quick

We are now genome sequencing many more positives (my company PacBio is one of the 3rd gen sequencers doing this worldwide)....so we can act far quicker....this to answer your question is how a nastier virus can be determined along with direct work with current vaccines available and their efficacy

It is very likely summer will help while everyone gets vaccinated

When we get to herd immunity then the numbers seriously ill in hospital will be very low and more aligned to a flu season...thus more manageable for the NHS.

We as a country cannot carry on indefinitely locked down but it is the data that determines the current situation and future situation (modelling)

Personally the only part that concerns me is foreign travel until other countries catch up with vaccinations and I can see this being later to open up and it will be with a vaccine passport for many of them

Foreign travel directly affects my work seeing as though I am meant to be across Europe Middle East and Africa right now but that can wait until it can be done safely


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Can't wait for the football to be back.

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I thought the league was going to publish its deliberation on Monday but so far the silence is deafening.



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